tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-140938929136406282.post4086146992544690781..comments2023-11-18T15:42:20.251-05:00Comments on DinoGoss: Know When To Fold 'EmMatt Martyniukhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04220900229537564466noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-140938929136406282.post-58904311701701327582014-03-24T09:47:49.003-04:002014-03-24T09:47:49.003-04:00i was shy and almost felt ashame to ask this actua...i was shy and almost felt ashame to ask this actually, but. I was wondering if you can help me buy this book in amazon.com <br />I can't order it on amazon cause i'm living in indonesia currently and I was looking for some one who can help me to buy this book and then send it to me in indonesia. i will refund your money of course. If you can help me, let me know at ridwanprijatn@yahoo.com<br />title of the book:the rise of birds<br />author: sankar chatterjee<br />price at most USD$18.00Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03586757659702923033noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-140938929136406282.post-83706607377661483132011-06-18T21:32:38.782-04:002011-06-18T21:32:38.782-04:00I agree the authors don't seem to take into ac...I agree the authors don't seem to take into account other variables either when they say that, though they do state the actual folding angle can't be calculated for most of the taxa examined.<br /><br />Another point which I just noticed now while coding Huaxiagnathus for the TWG matrix is that Caudipteryx's radiale may be disarticulated. Check out figure 8 of Hwang et al.'s Huaxiagnathus paper. The left radiale has the low angle (~18 degrees) Sullivan et al. use while the right radiale has an angle of 62 degrees, which is up in the pygostylian range. The authors mention this and say "this element may have been rotated out of its natural orientation". Could this be the case for Caudipteryx too? It would help explain why the element is so short. Note Caudipteryx specimen NGMC 97-4-A has a radiale angle of 47 degrees, still high but outside the pygostylian range. Allosaurus (Chure, 2001- fig. 2) has an apparent radiale angle of 18 degrees when viewed medially, compared to 2 degrees in extensor view. I wouldn't be surprised if Caudipteryx' radiale and Huaxiagnathus' right one have rotated into medial view. Partial rotation may be confounding other measured taxa as well.<br /><br />Aren't carpals fun?Mickey Mortimerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08831823442911513851noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-140938929136406282.post-18199768331201209712011-06-18T07:48:15.956-04:002011-06-18T07:48:15.956-04:00@Mickey: You may be right concerning Caudipteryx, ...@Mickey: You may be right concerning Caudipteryx, I admit I was a bit ocnfised on that point, though the authors do state "The extreme deflection of the SLC facet in oviraptorosaurs strongly suggests that the carpal joint was asymmetric to a degree comparable to that seen in avians, with great capacity for abduction and very little for adduction" directly after discussing the radiale angle in Caudipteryx, so I assumed they were talking specifically about that taxon. Figure 2 shows that the wrist of Caudipteryx is still significantly deflected even at minimum abduction to a degree comparable to Eoconfuciusornis.Matt Martyniukhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04220900229537564466noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-140938929136406282.post-13193362799199973592011-06-18T05:14:56.089-04:002011-06-18T05:14:56.089-04:00Er, I hadn't read this paper yet, but you made...Er, I hadn't read this paper yet, but you made a basic error here in assuming the radiale (note not radialae) angle is the major control on wrist angle. Note that contra your description, the radiale doesn't so much block extension (in the turkey it does because the extensor process hits it, but no non-ornithuromorph theropod has such a large process), as much as the angle of the distal radiale surface shows where the semilunate and rest of the hand would articulate on it. Now it's true that Caudipteryx has a high radiale angle, but what you're forgetting is that Sullivan et al. note two other necessary components for folding the wing tightly- the strong convexity of the proximal trochlea of<br />the carpometacarpus; and the proximal position<br />and incised topology of the cuneiform. As their figure shows, Caudipteryx has an unfused distal carpal II like Alxasaurus, which when considered part of the semilunate structure, gives it a rather flat proximal trochlea. The cuneiform/ulnare is only known from NGMC 94-4-A (unlabeled carpal overlapping the radius in Ji et al.'s 1998 figure 5c), but seems to be in lateral view so any incision isn't visible. But the incised (v-shaped) ulnare only exists in avialans, and is lacking in oviraptorosaurs. Without a strongly convex semilunate or an ulnare groove to slide the hand into, I doubt Caudipteryx could flex as much as oviraptorids and paravians, and its ability was certainly less than pygostylians. This combined with its low deltopectoral crest, unfused semilunate, short arms, reduced third digit and weakly curved unguals make me think Caudipteryx was in the process of losing predatory function for its wings.<br /><br />Incidentally, note the supplementary info incorrectly calls IGM 100/42 Rinchenia (a mistake made by Snively's papers too) and the "Grusimimus" specimen Harpymimus.Mickey Mortimerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08831823442911513851noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-140938929136406282.post-38747174416186910762011-06-06T16:05:33.367-04:002011-06-06T16:05:33.367-04:00I'd buy that book.I'd buy that book.Emily Willoughbyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03912270684173200144noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-140938929136406282.post-70949705802735729792011-06-05T11:52:57.825-04:002011-06-05T11:52:57.825-04:00Another excellent and informative post as always! ...Another excellent and informative post as always! That's it, you need to write that book on things that anyone who wants to restore prehistoric birds should know but always get wrong or don't think much about, presumably with a less cumbersome title.Albertonykushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00345306530772709064noreply@blogger.com